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I don’t think it’s as simple as “new staff just say yes.” There is a gap, but it isn’t about age or character. It’s about culture. Many newer practitioners have entered a service that is already overstretched, target-driven and short on experienced mentors. They’ve trained in an environment shaped by SFO anxiety, compliance metrics and constant performance scrutiny. In that climate, you quickly learn what feels safest: follow the direction given, escalate upwards, don’t rock the boat. That isn’t weakness. It’s self-preservation.
Those who trained 15–20 plus years ago came into something different. There was more reflective supervision, more protected space for professional judgement, and more confidence in constructive disagreement. You could push back on an SPO or even a PDU head and it was understood as professional discussion, not defiance. That space feels so much narrower now.
The real issue isn’t whether newer staff “say yes.” It’s whether anyone, new or experienced, genuinely feels able to say, respectfully, “I don’t agree,” or “This allocation isn’t safe,” without fearing consequences. A professional service must have room for challenge. If practitioners can't question workload, allocation or risk decisions without worrying about performance measures or reputational damage, that’s not a generational flaw. That’s a psychological safety problem. The question isn’t why some say yes, it's whether the system makes it safe to say no.
I don’t think it’s as simple as “new staff just say yes.” There is a gap, but it isn’t about age or character. It’s about culture. Many newer practitioners have entered a service that is already overstretched, target-driven and short on experienced mentors. They’ve trained in an environment shaped by SFO anxiety, compliance metrics and constant performance scrutiny. In that climate, you quickly learn what feels safest: follow the direction given, escalate upwards, don’t rock the boat. That isn’t weakness. It’s self-preservation.
Those who trained 15–20 plus years ago came into something different. There was more reflective supervision, more protected space for professional judgement, and more confidence in constructive disagreement. You could push back on an SPO or even a PDU head and it was understood as professional discussion, not defiance. That space feels so much narrower now.
The real issue isn’t whether newer staff “say yes.” It’s whether anyone, new or experienced, genuinely feels able to say, respectfully, “I don’t agree,” or “This allocation isn’t safe,” without fearing consequences. A professional service must have room for challenge. If practitioners can't question workload, allocation or risk decisions without worrying about performance measures or reputational damage, that’s not a generational flaw. That’s a psychological safety problem. The question isn’t why some say yes, it's whether the system makes it safe to say no.
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Recruitment numbers look reassuring on a spreadsheet.
Recruitment numbers look reassuring on a spreadsheet.
“1,300 trainees onboarded.”
“FTE up this quarter.”
“Shortfall reduced.”
But probation is not a call centre. It is not a processing factory. It is a profession built on judgement, risk formulation, relational skill and accumulated experience. You do not learn that from a target. Experience in probation isn’t just about years served. It’s about pattern recognition. It’s about having seen escalation before it escalates. It’s about knowing when a compliant presentation masks something more concerning. It’s about understanding local services, local courts, local patterns of behaviour. It’s about confidence to challenge poor decisions including from above. You cannot fast-track that.
Recruiting thousands will plug a numerical gap. It does not plug an experience gap. And here is the uncomfortable part: when the system is overstretched and inexperienced at the same time, risk doesn’t disappear. It just becomes harder to detect and harder to manage. That’s bad for the organisation. It’s worse for new staff. Because where exactly are they meant to learn from?
If experienced practitioners are carrying overload, leaving, or being performance-managed for structural failings, the informal supervision that actually builds competence erodes. E-learning modules don’t replace corridor conversations. They don’t replace reflective debrief after a near miss. They don’t replace a senior colleague saying, “I’ve seen this before , slow down.”
Probation used to develop people through apprenticeship in the truest sense. Now we are onboarding at scale while simultaneously hollowing out the very people who hold the institutional memory. You can’t run a risk critical public protection service on enthusiasm and PowerPoint. Numbers matter. Of course they do. But if experience is treated as optional, we are storing up problems that won’t show on a recruitment dashboard until they show somewhere else. And by then, it’s too late.
******
So let's just look at what the numbers actually mean on the ground. Yes, recruitment is up. Yes, trainee numbers are high. Yes, FTE figures can be presented as improving. But there is a difference between headcount and experience. If 1,300 trainees enter the system while hundreds of experienced Band 4s quietly leave or step back, the spreadsheet looks healthier. The skill mix doesn't. What you end up with is:
So let's just look at what the numbers actually mean on the ground. Yes, recruitment is up. Yes, trainee numbers are high. Yes, FTE figures can be presented as improving. But there is a difference between headcount and experience. If 1,300 trainees enter the system while hundreds of experienced Band 4s quietly leave or step back, the spreadsheet looks healthier. The skill mix doesn't. What you end up with is:
• Teams heavy with PQiPs and newly qualified officers
• Fewer long-serving practitioners at the top of bands
• Middle managers supervising people who are still learning the craft
On paper: recovery. In practice: fragility.
Probation is not a production line. It is a judgement profession. And judgement is learned through experience, through seeing risk escalate, de escalate, surprise you, and sometimes outwit you. That can't be accelerated through e-learning modules. When experience thins out, which is happening now, practice naturally becomes more procedural. People lean on templates. Risk assessments become defensive. Recalls increase because discretion feels dangerous. Oversight tightens. Anxiety rises. That shift doesn’t show up neatly in workforce statistics. It shows up in:
• Rising recall numbers
• Over cautious decision making
• Burnout in new staff who don’t feel properly mentored
• Middle managers stretched between targets and reality
And when something goes seriously wrong, it won’t be framed as a structural experience deficit. It will be framed as individual failure. That’s the risk.
The Sentencing Act only works if probation has the depth of experience to manage complexity safely in the community. If we plug gaps numerically but hollow out institutional memory, we create a system that looks staffed but behaves brittle.
Recruitment is necessary. Retention is critical and that what those at the top either don't recognise or choose to ignore. Probation doesn’t fail slowly. It fails when judgement margins narrow and something tips. And at the moment, the conversation feels very focused on the numbers and not nearly focused enough on the experience behind them.
All contributions Anon
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cpqwlwndj9yo
ReplyDeleteThe frontrunner to become the country's most senior civil servant was spoken to about her management and leadership style after an inquiry into a complaint against her.
Dame Antonia Romeo, understood to be the government's favoured candidate for cabinet secretary, was investigated over three allegations when she worked in New York in 2017.
The outcome of that investigation was "there is no case to answer", Dame Antonia was told in a letter seen by BBC News. But a source said she faced "tough conversations" about her leadership style.
A Cabinet Office spokesperson emphasised that it was a single complaint that was dismissed, and said Dame Antonia has a long "record of excellent public service".
A source said that "there were some issues of personal style that grated with people".
"That was not an easy conversation. She took her medicine," they said, but they added there had been a thorough investigation and nothing of substance was upheld.
The three allegations came from a single complaint and were related to her use of expenses and accusations of bullying when she was the government's consul-general in New York, the BBC understands.
In a letter seen by BBC News outlining the outcome of the investigation Rupert McNeil, then the government chief people officer, told Dame Antonia "there is no case to answer".
McNeil added in the letter from March 2017: "I appreciate processes of this type are always distressing, but as discussed, they are rich sources of feedback about management and leadership style.
"I know from our conversation that you are very alert to this, and this process has given you rich insight."
The letter, marked "official - sensitive", was shared with Jeremy Heywood, the then-cabinet secretary, John Manzoni, the then-permanent secretary at the Cabinet Office, Kim Darroch, then-British ambassador to the US, the HR directors at the foreign office and cabinet office, and Simon McDonald, now Lord McDonald, who was then-head of the foreign office.
Lord McDonald made a highly unusual intervention this week, saying he had tried to get in touch with No10 about the possibility of Dame Antonia being appointed and warning "more due diligence" was needed.
"The due diligence needs to be thorough. If the candidate mentioned in the media is the one, in my view, the due diligence has some way still to go," he told Channel 4 News.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/antonia-romeo-cabinet-secretary-keir-starmer-b2921205.html
DeleteMonday 16 February 2026 13:35 GMT
Sir Keir Starmer has defended Dame Antonia Romeo as an “outstanding leader” amid growing expectations she will be picked to succeed Sir Chris Wormald as cabinet secretary.
Dame Antonia, who has been tipped to replace Sir Chris, previously faced allegations of bullying related to her time as consul-general in New York, but she was later cleared by the Cabinet Office following an inquiry.
Asked about reports that the senior civil servant had been spoken to about her management style following the inquiry, the prime minister’s official spokesperson insisted that Dame Antonia’s record “speaks for itself”.
Yes, her record does speak for itself. In the years she was responsible for probation she managed to fuck it up completely, dismantling a previously gold-standard service, enriching corporate thieves, then overseeing the shitshow of trying (& failing) to repair the damage she'd done in her return as perm sec at moj.
Probation is in dire straits; it has haemorrhaged experienced staff, is significantly under-resourced, overwhelmed by workloads & unable to fulfil its role. HMIProbation says the service is operating, at best, at 30% functionality.
romeo oversaw the whole thing, relished every minute & was rewarded by her right-leaning political chums with ennoblement, riches & promotions.
Now we see starmer fawning over her like epstein at a kids' party.
This puts probation in context, politically, i.e. it was never regarded with anything but contempt by the political classes because it strived for humanity, compassion & understanding... and on the whole it used to manage that delicate balancing act of treating people as human beings whilst upholding boundaries.
Now? The interference of political will (straw, grayling, etc) & politically-motivated civil servants (narey, brennan, spurr, romeo, rees, barton, et al) has led to the demolition of what worked (mostly) and reduced it to a pile of ineffective rubble.
There is a well-documented labour market pattern in the UK and internationally: occupations that become majority female tend to experience relative pay decline over time compared to similarly skilled, male-dominated occupations.
ReplyDeleteThis isn’t about capability. It’s about valuation.
Examples frequently cited in research:
• Teaching (majority female workforce; pay stagnation relative to other graduate professions)
• Nursing (high responsibility, regulated profession; persistent pay disputes)
• Social work (statutory authority; lower pay relative to comparable risk roles)
• Administrative civil service grades (heavily feminised; slower progression and flatter pay growth)
The trend is sometimes described as “occupational feminisation and pay compression.” When a profession shifts demographically, political and economic narratives often shift with it. Work becomes framed as “care” or “support” rather than “authority” or “enforcement,” even when statutory powers and legal responsibility remain unchanged.
Probation is now a predominantly female workforce.
At the same time, probation:
• Holds statutory enforcement powers
• Writes court reports influencing liberty
• Manages serious risk of harm
• Supervises individuals subject to recall and licence conditions
• Carries SFO accountability
Yet culturally and politically, probation is often positioned as a “support service” rather than a frontline public protection authority.
By contrast, police and prison services, historically male-dominated, are more frequently framed in political discourse as security critical infrastructure. That framing influences funding narratives and public tolerance for pay settlements.
This is not an argument that other sectors are overpaid. It's a question about valuation.
If a profession with statutory authority, legal accountability and public protection responsibility experiences sustained real terms pay erosion while recruitment rhetoric focuses on “vocation” and “service,” is it reasonable to ask whether demographic composition plays a role in how that work is economically and politically prioritised?
The issue isn’t gender itself.
It is how society and government value work once it is coded as care adjacent rather than enforcement adjacent.
And valuation ultimately shapes pay.
For context, I’m a Band 4 at the top of the scale on £42,000.
ReplyDeleteAccording to the table shared by NAPO, probation pay has increased by 11% since 2010. Over the same period:
• Police staff: 39%
• Prison officers: 40.3%
• Local government: 35.7%
• Health: 32.7%
If Band 4 pay had tracked those sectors, £42,000 today would sit roughly between:
• £55,700 (health equivalent)
• £58,900 (prison officer equivalent)
That’s a gap of approximately £13,700–£16,900 per year.
Separately, Bank of England inflation data shows cumulative inflation of roughly 49–50% between 2010 and 2024. A Band 4 salary of £35,727 in 2010 would need to be around £53,500–£54,000 today just to maintain purchasing power.
Current top scale: £42,000.
That is a real-terms shortfall of around £11,500 per year simply to stand still.
So when people question the narrative around “22% since 2010,” the issue isn’t that they can’t read a percentage table. It’s that they are comparing inflation, comparable public sector roles and actual take home value. Those comparisons show a consistent erosion. No myth. No spin. Just arithmetic.
Yet another email laced with soft coercion to try and persuade us to accept the offer...
ReplyDeleteplease share the content of the email + mcewan's words; we don't all work for probation.
DeleteI see they've now sent out McEwan to tell us all how grateful we should be for the crumbs off the table.
ReplyDeleteI haven't received this, I'm assuming it was sent to all staff?
DeleteI think it may get sent by your regions comms team?
DeleteYeah read it, same bollocks telling us how amazing we are and how great the offer is. I'd prefer they were honest and just told us the Treasury are in charge, we at HMPPS have no say in the matter even though we pretended to fight on your behalf and this is all we have to offer even though we know it's shit.
DeleteIn isolation, the email might be described as routine communication ahead of a ballot.
ReplyDeleteIn context though after that staff call with the other week and then the “myth buster” piece it doesn’t feel neutral. It feels like pressure, soft coercion is exactly how I'd frame it too!
When senior leaders repeatedly emphasise how strong an offer is, how competitive it is, and how much has been secured, it stops sounding informational and starts sounding directional.
Staff are quite capable of reading a pay offer and forming a view without narrative framing thanks!
What seems missing is any real acknowledgement of the anger. Not a footnote. Not a “we recognise concerns” line. No genuine recognition of why people are furious, none of that, all we get is message that we should be grateful for the incredibly generous offer.
Are senior leaders really so unaware of that anger? Or choosing not to hear it? Because the strategy so far feels less like listening and more like repetition. They think if the message is stated often enough, frustration will dissolve and we’ll simply comply, as has happened so many times before.
But this time the numbers are out in the open. The comparisons are clear. The real-terms gap isn’t abstract, it’s measurable.
If leadership won’t fully hear the feeling, I hope the ballot will.
Whatever people decide, I hope they use it.
Timpson puts head above parapet:-
ReplyDeletehttps://insidetime.org/newsround/prisons-minister-i-prefer-the-term-colleagues-to-offenders/
Prisons Minister Lord Timpson (pictured) has said that rather than referring to prisoners as ‘offenders’, he prefers to use the term ‘colleagues’.
An official Ministry of Justice ‘style guide’, published in 2022, says that ‘prisoners’ or ‘offenders’ are acceptable terms to describe people in prison, whereas ‘residents’ is not. It does not mention ‘colleagues’.
Lord Timpson, whilst participating in a podcast in front of a live audience this month, was challenged by his interviewer on his use of the term ‘offenders’. Phil Maguire, co-house of the Secret Life of Prisons podcast, told the Minister: “I have form for this, and said the same thing to [former justice secretary] David Gauke when we spoke with him, but please change the language and do not use the term offenders.”
Lord Timpson replied: “I am here speaking for the Ministry of Justice and that is the term used there. I would normally use the word ‘colleagues’.”
Maguire continued: “Can you please use your influence in the Ministry to change the culture?” The audience at the Clinks charity conference applauded the exchange. The podcast, presented by Maguire with co-host Paula Harriott, is produced by National Prison Radio.
The 2022 style guide was issued by the MoJ at the behest of then-justice secretary Dominic Raab. Journalists were briefed at the time that Mr Raab considered the term ‘residents’ to be ‘woke’ and ‘politically correct’ language which undermined public confidence that prisoners were being punished for their crimes.
All staff employed by the Ministry of Justice, HM Prison and Probation Service, and private sector prison providers were told to adhere to the style guide. The document has only three entries:
When referring to people in prison, staff are allowed to use the terms “prisoners”, “people in prison” or “offenders. They cannot use “residents”, “service users” or “clients”.
When referring to people leaving prison, staff can say “prison leavers”, “people leaving prison”, “people resettling in the community” or “ex-offenders”. They cannot say “service users” or clients”.
When referring to prison accommodation, staff can say “cell”. They cannot say “room”.
A Ministry of Justice spokesperson said at the time of its publication: “Our style guide will ensure clear and consistent language is used in all communications relating to adult prisons and probation services.”
Prior to being appointed as a minister and elevated to the House of Lords in 2024 following Labour’s election victory, James Timpson was Chief Executive Officer of the Timpson Group, a family firm known for employing ex-prisoners at its shoe-mending and key-cutting outlets.
Rubbish qualification , no professionalism , robots , clones , surprised you got 4%
Delete“Robots” and “clones” isn’t analysis.
DeleteIf you think there’s a problem with standards or training, care to expand? Otherwise it’s just noise.
So now we have to get used to being called "colleague managers" & we have "colleague management units".
Delete@18:36 love that you have the time to come on this forum to offer constructive criticism or valuable argument about a profession you obviously havnt worked hard for , understand or deliver !
Delete‘colleagues’ !! That’s just dumb!!
DeleteDefo
ReplyDelete‘Colleagues’ what a load of tosh all you can expect from someone associated with the two tier buffoon.
ReplyDeleteDon’t panic Mr. Mainwaring 🤣 Extended like the last two deadlines, they will never hit the target unless they pay existing staff the right salary.
ReplyDelete⏰ Trainee probation officer programme deadline extended – don’t miss out!
There’s still time to apply for the trainee probation officer programme (PQiP).
The deadline has been extended to Monday 2 March at 11.55pm in:
East of England
Kent, Surrey and Sussex
London
South Central
The deadline has been extended to Monday 23 February at 11.55pm in:
East Midlands
Greater Manchester
North East
North West
South West
Wales
Yorkshire and Humber
If you’re interested there’s still time to submit your application. This is your chance to earn while you learn, gain a degree equivalent qualification, and play an essential role in your community and the wider justice system.
Nothing says “high demand, thriving profession” quite like repeatedly extending the application deadline.
DeleteWe’re told the staffing pipeline is being strengthened with 1,300 trainees. Yet deadlines keep shifting. Almost as if the issue isn’t awareness… but attractiveness.
And while we’re here, just a small but important point.
PQiP leads to a Level 6 professional qualification. That sits at the same academic level as a bachelor’s degree. It is not the same thing as being awarded a university degree.
Calling it “degree equivalent” is shorthand for level, not status.
That distinction matters not because the training lacks value, but because clarity builds credibility.
The bigger question isn’t the label. It’s whether newly qualified staff enter a service where:
• Experienced mentors are available
• Workloads are manageable
• Professional judgement is respected
• Pay progression makes staying worthwhile
You can rename a qualification a you can extend a deadline.
But unless the job itself is sustainable, recruitment campaigns become a revolving door and that’s the part no advert fixes.
No panic though. Everything’s fine.
If it ain't a degree it just ain't no degree FFS.
ReplyDeleteI read an article this week arguing that with AI, many people think it’s overhyped while those closest to it say disruption is already happening and white-collar work will change faster than most expect.
ReplyDeleteThat gave me pause.
AI is already in probation. We’ve been given guidance on how to use it to support drafting and administrative tasks. Fine. Used well, it could ease pressure.
But in a service with staffing shortfalls, rising recalls and constant efficiency drives, we should at least ask the uncomfortable question:
Is AI being introduced as support or will it quietly become a way to plug structural gaps?
Probation isn’t just text production. It’s judgement, challenge, experience and relational skill. If AI boosts output, the spreadsheets will look healthier.
What happens if “support” becomes “substitution”?
In a service with:
• 1,555 FTE Band 4 shortfall (Sept 2025)
• 1,700+ staff in training
• escalating recall numbers
• constant pressure to show efficiency
AI doesn’t just look like a tool.
It starts to look like a workforce strategy.
If reports can be drafted in minutes, dashboards improve.
If summaries are auto-generated, throughput rises.
If risk language is standardised, consistency appears stronger.
But visible productivity is not the same as professional capacity.
If AI becomes the way we compensate for experience gaps, we need to be honest about that now not after the next serious failure when everyone asks who exercised judgement.Technology can assist practice but it can't replace it.