Thursday 12 February 2015

MoJ Away Day 3

Yes it's yet another helping from that MoJ event last week. With an election just a couple of months away, I feel it's important we all know what's been said behind closed doors in order that blame can be laid at the correct door when the wheels inevitably come off TR - and we know they are already:- 
Man in the Pub is on form tonight - he says the big players are seeking to renegotiate the contracts already. Did someone once say "you couldn't make it up". I will let you know further when I can afford another couple of whiskys for him again. 
Your man is correct - my woman says matters referred to those damn consultants again 'for urgent advice' yes really.......

Sodexo have alerted us to a potential delay in their supply chain delivery of TTG work to the under 12 month population unless we can support this on an interim basis by using our own staff.
4th February 2015 London - Atrium Event for MoJ Staff

Chris Grayling: Great, thank you Lord Faulks, lastly but definitely not leastly, Andrew Selous the Prisons and Probation Minister.

Andrew Selous: Thank you very much, Secretary of State. I'm the newbie on the ministerial team, only appointed on the 16th of July last year, and to be honest after 13 years in the House of Commons I'd spend the previous four as Parliamentary Private Secretary to Iain Duncan Smith, I wasn’t really sure what to expect, arriving in government for the first time and I've been hugely, delighted I have to say by the incredible support I've had, not just from my private office, all of whom have given me outstanding support, but from the many, many people who I've met who’ve come in to brief me on a whole range of issues in my office, but also just as importantly I'm so conscious of the – the many, many people who do a huge amount of work for me that I never see.

I'm talking about the people who write, the ministerial correspondence, the freedom of information requests, the parliamentary questions. I know that is a massive amount of work, they're consistently of a – of a very, very high standard and I'd like to say a big thank you to, all of you who have done that work for me.

I've also been incredibly, impressed at the way in which the department has picked up and run with the issues which have been really important to me personally. One of the issues I've been concerned with is to try and make sure that the family relationships of prisoners stay strong while they're in prison, I'm supported in that belief by Chief Inspector of Prisons who did a recent thematic report saying that that was a very powerful rehabilitative factor.

The department has picked that up and run with it, we've had a day at NOMS with prison governors engaging on it, really, really pleased to see that.

I had a meeting only last week looking at what we can do to give prisoners, the second chance that they need, perhaps because the chance they didn’t get at their school in their early life in terms of their education, their literacy, their numeracy, their IT skills, and I think with the basic screening that we brought in August last year we had a real opportunity to drive that forward and not least because of the TR reforms which the Secretary of State started off with, that will make a massive difference as we continue that help, with education and with skills and with the world of work, as, offenders leave and go through the gate in – in to their supervision within the community.

It's been great to engage with all those in the transforming youth, custody team, and, the work that we’re doing on youth justice generally, I'd like to say thank you to everyone there. Those working on a whole range of reducing reoffending issues, that’s also been fantastic work. Those who work on the issue of foreign national offenders, a continuing issue of importance, one the Prime Minister takes a very close interest in. We’ll perhaps have an opportunity to take forward some of those discussions at the Global Law Summit which the Secretary of State referred to.

I'd like to pay tribute to the Estates Team, I know you've won a lot of prizes across Whitehall, when I was with the Chief Executive of my local hospital recently I asked her if the extension to my new local hospital was being, undertaken on the BIM system, the building information model, she didn’t know about it so I suggest that she put a call in to Janet Crawford of the Estates Team because I know we have huge expertise in that area here.

Earlier this morning I was over at NOMS just thanking one of the policy teams there for a piece of work that they’ve done and erm, I'd like to pay tribute to – to them as well, those involved in Public Protection.

And finally but very, very much not least, I'm generally in a prison every week. Last Thursday I went to two - Bristol and Cardiff. I try and get out as much as possible to visit our probation, officers and, our prison staff around the country who do an absolutely amazing job. I haven't yet come away from a prison or a probation office without being genuinely inspired by the things which I have seen there.

But a huge thank you, from me particularly to those of you that I haven't had the privilege of meeting who have supported me so well in my time in the department.

Chris Grayling: Well thank you Andrew and thank you to the team. And we've only talked about some of the areas today, and I know there are many of you in this room today who work for units we've not been able to talk about but the expressions of thanks go right across the whole department. Every one of you is performing an important role. Often the things that make a difference are the things that are not seen. There are many working on other important projects as well, I'm really grateful to all of you.

We are moving forward, we’re dealing with the challenges we've got, I think we’re making real progress, but it – none of this would happen without you and I'm very grateful.

I think now we’ll go over and take some questions, I think Ursula’s got one or two of the ones that have been sent in advance and then take some from the floor.

Ursula Brennan: Yes, I'm going to pick up a couple of the questions that were raised in advance and then if you be thinking about your questions, please make sure you stick your hand right up because we have some roving mics.

I'll start off with a question actually for the Secretary of State, which is a question about what direction you believe that the MOJ and the courts and tribunals will go. We know we've got these various reforms that we've got in place but what's your notion of looking beyond the election and for the longer term, where do you think, what the challenges are that the MOJ and the court service will be facing for the future?

Chris Grayling: Well so I would love to think that the financial pressures will go away after the election, but regardless of the outcome of the election they won't. So it's going to be I think a continuous process of transformation, and I think digitalisation of what we do, and there's been good work done already in the office of Public Guardian, there's good work now being done on the Common Platform Programme, I think that we’re going to have to be really cutting edge and embracing the use of digital technologies to make things work more effectively and more efficiently, and I think it's – it's inevitable that will happen.

Ursula Brennan: I've had a couple of questions in advance about pay. People have asked about the Chancellor’s autumn statement suggesting that public sector workers would have to be realistic about pay in the next parliament, and looking at the pay freeze and the 1% increase and people looking at, what's happening to people who are on the bottom of their scale and – and what will be happening to them and then people who are at the top of their scale and are not seeing pay rises, as the Secretary of State says realistically we've still got a really tough challenge after the election in the public sector because paying down the deficit is still going to require us to find more savings in public services.

When we come to look at pay we are trying to balance a number of things. We do want to shorten pay spines so people don’t perpetually find themselves hovering near the bottom of the pay spine. We do have to think about the extent to which our pay rates are consistent with what's going on in the market, and in the market pay rates do vary, according to the grades of our staff and the locations of them, so that's something that we have to try and bear in mind.

We also want to try and reward the people who are doing something extra, and we still have the ability to give people a reward in year for the people who have worked extra hard, but I know that in the next parliament that balancing act and that juggling act of a limited amount of money available for public sector pay and the different things that we’re trying to address and the need to attract and retain people with the special skills we need in the public service I'm afraid that is going to carry on being a challenge for the future. I can't see that getting hugely easier in the next few years. So I think it's important to be aware of that.

Chris Grayling: I mean, look, I know it's been a really difficult time on pay and I know it's probably gonna carry on being a really difficult time on pay, the first thing I wanted to say is that there's all kinds of stories around about politicians, about MPs and let’s just kind of clear the air from the point of minister’s pay.

The difference between ministers’ pay and your pay in terms of trends over the last five years has been this, ministers’ pay was cut by 5% in the first year, and it's remained frozen ever since, so although MPs got a 1% pay rise, that 1% pay rise was taken off our ministerial pay so we've had a ministerial pay freeze all the way through, and I think we’ll carry on doing so until we get to a point where public sector pay is improving. And that's right and proper and I support that, I would not want to stand in front of you having personally got a whacking pay rise and you guys not, that will not happen as long as I'm Secretary of State.

You know we have faced and will continue to face difficult financial decisions. Things are moving in the right direction in my view, but I would by lying to you if I said all the difficult challenges were behind us because they're not.

But, what Ursula has said is right, we will always do what we can on the pay front but you can only deal with the world as it is rather than how you would like it to be.

Ursula Brennan: Okay. Let’s see if we can take some questions from the floor, so if you've got questions, could you put your hands up please and I'll also carry on with the questions that have been supplied in advance.

40 comments:

  1. It's an art form to be able to say so little with so much. I was watching the Idiots Guide to Politics on BBC 3 last night and they had a short bit with Gordon Brown's former spin doctor on it talking about how politicians particularly at the senior level constantly "lie without lying" because they don't want to be held to account for anything they say. Sums it all up rather perfectly really.

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  2. Well done to the bod who got that stuff to JB - thanks for publishing it.

    Lets have more from inside the senior meeting rooms of NPS, NOMs & CRCs - we know TR will fail, the question is when and how will practitioners be able to influence restructuring?

    Selous is beyond parody.

    Interesting questions selected by Brennan from her 'troops' - what is coming next and inevitably and understandably - pay - presumption & paraphrasing) are low grade Civil Servants ever going to get back to a situation of reasonable & regular pay rises.

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  3. http://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2015/02/11/is-anyone-at-the-moj-listening-to-simon-hughes

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  4. I would not want to stand in front of you having personally got a whacking pay rise and you guys not,

    Nor indeed did they get a cosey little flat in Pimlico Chris did they?

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  5. Coming back to the problem with Becnh and TTG, man in pub tells me that staff are rebelling and now withdrawing their applications for TTG.

    Top marks to them.

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  6. This blog is pure comedy gold! It is funnier than Yes Minister and whoever supplied this material THANK YOU, it actually brightened my day!
    a PO

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    1. Glad it wasn't just me thinking Yes Minister as I read it!

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  7. Is this satire?! I genuinely can't fathom it!

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  8. "I would not want to stand in front of you having personally got a whacking pay rise and you guys not, that will not happen as long as I'm Secretary of State."

    Well, Chris, that statement means nowt because you won't be SoS at MoJ for much longer, will you? You know that, hence your carefully crafted caveat - which thus allows you to pocket any and every "whacking pay rise" that's on its way for MPs &/or pay cheques for consultants to global enterprise. I wonder where you're going? What treat has Dave got lined up for you? You guys are expecting to stay in power, so what department can expect to be Grayling'd next? (Grayling: verb - to act irresponsibly causing irreparable damage; to intentionally cause disruption & distress; to ensure chaos replaces structure).

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  9. Oy Chris did you ever sell that flat? What did you do with t'profit? Eee lad, I hope you haven't done owt daft like transfer the chuffin thing into tha wifes or nippers name???

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    1. Or send it on holiday t'Geneva?

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    2. I do hope he has, and gets caught. If he ever came to see me for supervision I'd take great pleasure in giving him a range of options for what he could do with his £46.

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  10. There is no capacity for PSOs to bail out Sodexo/NACO with TTG. It's just not going to happen. Watch this space, the train crash is coming and it's going to be big.

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    1. Shennegans started in DTV. Email from the Chief that, until further notice, we are to treat normal appointments as RAR's.
      Hits those targets at least, lets just hope that nobody reports her to NOMS.

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    2. NOMS won't care, it's the local press that need to know what's going on. Get that whistle out :-)

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    3. "treat normal appts as RARS".........I'm not sure what this means ...bobbyjoe

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    4. Rars are a separate appt with external agencies, dugs, alcohl, ete etc and a set number is given by the Court as psrt of a Order. They are supposed to be separate and not counted as a normal appt with your PO. To do otherwise defeats the purpose of the Court Order and undermines the purpose of supervision. I think this will be illegal and the Chief responsible (if this is factual) will probably not be in a job for much longer.

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    5. looks like offence-focussed work is out of vogue. It will come back around full circle.

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    6. There's no reason not to manage current supervision in the same way as RAR's..shame more people don't read National Standards

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    7. Your Chief should know that the number of days specified under a RAR is a maximum number, not a minimum - theoretically the Responsible Officer could deem the RAR completed without any of the days done, should they feel the rehabilitative purposes have been achieved... corrupt as anything obviously.

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  11. Ok, this is different from my understanding after the ORA briefing in DLNR CRC. My understanding was that the court sets a max number of days on a RAR not the number of appts - the number of days would be based on info given by NPS/CRC at sentencing time re what is available in that area eg victim work, women's work & also normal supervision. A half-hour supervision appt can be used for this & would count as 1 of the days. Seperate requirements should still be given for eg programmes/UPW/DRR as the RAR only replaces the supervision & specified activity requirements - this is my understanding, I am happy to be put right if I have got it wrong.......bobbyjoe

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    1. 2.4 ​Although the maximum period of the activities is expressed in days, the instructions in respect of the activities will be expressed in terms of a specific activity and the duration of that activity. A day is not defined in legislation but this does not mean 24 hours of activity. This means that an activity which only lasts for 2 hours would count as one day for the purposes of calculating the number of days on which an offender has participated in an activity, to ensure that the maximum number is not exceeded. Equally if an offender is required to undertake two separate activities on the same day, this would also only count as one day for the purposes of calculatin g the number of days on which the offender has participated in an activity.

      So, if Joe Blogs comes i. To see you or I then that is ONE appt. if he see's ETE on the same day, it's still ONE appt. it must not be counted as a RAR as it's within the 24 hour period. Basically DTV are being told to ignore the guidance from NOMS and put the initial supervision appt down as a RAR.

      Confused yet? Probably not half as much as our offenders will be.

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    2. The supervision appointments do not - or at least do not have to - count as RAR days. You, as the irresponsible Responsible Officer, could require your lucky client to attend every day of the week to see you, and they still wouldn't have done any of their RAR days.

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  12. Jim… ex po here, not retired, just moved on years ago into other ways of making a difference rather than a profit. 2 Millions views will roll around tonight…. just saying'… that a lot of communication. Congratulations. Its what POs do… always have, always will ;)

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    1. Blimey my typing is shocking. That should read "2 Million views will roll around tonight…. just saying… that's a lot of communication." There, that's better. I was a PO for 17 years. Wrote a lot of SERs. I would never have got away with typos then. No reason to start now...

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    2. Ex PO - you are right and thanks for noticing! I've been out doing some serious networking that happily included a libation or two - I wonder who will win a bottle of their choice for a screen shot showing 2 million?

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    3. Mine's a Tixylix *cough*

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  13. I understand almost all of the above. Are your managers saying that a supervision appt and an ETE appt on the same day counts as two RAR days? that is clearly wrong. But, in my view, this means that if you just see Joe Bloggs for a half-hour appt for supervision (which could be the initial induction appt) and he does not have any other appts that day it still counts as 1 RAR day......how else could it be recorded as there is no longer a supervision requirement on the new Orders?......what do you think?............Bobbyjoe

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    1. 1x Supervision on Monday = 0 RAR days.
      1x Supervision + 1x ETE both on Monday = 1 RAR day.
      1x Supervision on Monday, 1x ETE on Tuesday = 1 RAR day.
      1x ETE on Monday, 1x Accommodation on Monday = 1 RAR day.
      1x ETE on Monday, 1x Accommodation on Tuesday = 2 RAR days.

      Whoever came up with this idea has clearly never met a Probation client.

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    2. Ok, it is just the first line I don't get, I understand all the rest.
      If a standalone supervision appt does not count as a RAR how can it be enforced if Joe Bloggs DNAs....he hasn't breached anything if it doesn't count surely........Bobbyjoe

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    3. I think the difficulty you're having is expecting it to make sense... ;-)

      The Responsible Officer can offer "appointments" as necessary to run the order, but these don't count towards RAR days. I have probably confused issues by putting "supervision" above as we are going to have to stop thinking of them as "supervision appointments".

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    4. Ok thanks....I hadn't previously picked up that these appointments don't count.......I'd better go back to the briefing notes.......cheers, Bobbyjoe

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    5. We were told supervision can be enforced through other legislation, although I'm not sure which.

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    6. Who will provide the ETE/Accom appts. Partner contracts are ending soon. Lurking Winks already park offenders on the Work Programme.

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  14. Congrats to the blog for imminent 2M whatever's. As I type this it reads 1999762. No idea how to screenshot - sounds like a dodgy 70's movie direction.

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  15. With all this bollocks going on, the voice thats missing is NAPOs.
    I really am starting to believe that Dehilia did more for Norwich 'where are you', then NAPO are doing for probation.
    At least a fucking statement or a news letter just to let us know you're still interested.
    NAPO should be keeping us informed about whats going on, not the workforce.
    STEP UP NAPO. Grab the nettle, and show you're worth my subs.
    It's time to show your worth.

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    1. Locally BeNCH napo are doing their bit with regards Sodexo and the PSO ttg fiasco. Nationally though I don't know where they are. Nationally they are pissing me right off. Time for IL to go.

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    2. PS how do I do a screenshot?!?

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  16. Well Mr Selous it is true to state that Probation staff are doing amazing work. Shame Mr Grayling chooses not to acknowledge the people who have actually done what he instructed. Those around his table and at his feet, none of them actually achieved anything.
    All but one of our team, each of us hanging on, doing our best and doing it very well, have now had enough. We are now completely overloaded, too too much is now expected of us. The IT hampers not helps and lets us down regularly. We have way too much to try and achieve. The managers are always elsewhere, attending meetings and training that they do not share in any way. They don't see, don't listen and do nothing to manage or suggest any solutions. They are either incompetent or also overwhelmed and hiding away because they have no idea what to do. We are training and supporting new people, the trainers also nowhere to be seen. Our health and well being is being destroyed. Our home lives damaged, our children learning that to be committed, to care about doing a great job, to go to work every day , means exhaustion, broken sleep, tears and frustration. We enable and support people, many out of prison and into work and find ourselves faced with increasing numbers earning similar if not higher incomes.Great for them, wonderful for their families, fantastic for the tax payer, BUT are they awoken in the night with panic and anxiety due to carrying a huge responsibility and juggling so so many peoples lives, problems, risks and associated tasks that they live each day in fear of dropping even one...and then being blamed for the consequences, for not doing something that those sitting in judgement would never consider doing themselves.
    Keep going Mr Selous. carry on Mr Grayling, pat yourselves on the back, pay yourselves more and deny us, the Police, the Prison Officers, the Nurses , Teachers, Social workers.Fire fighters, all of us, public servants .. people who keep it all going, are motivated and committed to improving and enhancing the lives and safety of all of us, including you Mr Selous, and you Mr Grayling, yes even you... who do you call to save you in a fire, to free you from a crushed vehicle , to find and secure the person who stole from your home or attacked someone you loved. to nurse you to health, to support you through mental illness, to teach the next generations, . People like us you would call on, that's who. The people who were happy to work, often over and above expectation, not asking for excessive incomes, just fair and enough to secure our lives and our families. Law abiding, responsible people, the people you and yours have treated with such deep disregard and immeasurable contempt.

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